Written Debates

McDonald-Preston Debate: Preston's Affirmative Summary

McDonald -V- Preston Debate

Preston’s Final Affirmative– Summary


 

 

You will seldom read such desperation, bad logic and self contradiction as in Jerry’ last negative.

 

Let me re-state and summarize what I have established.

I have proven irrefutably that all NT eschatology is the reiteration of the OT promises made to Old Covenant Israel, Israel after the flesh (Acts 24:14f; Romans 8:23-9:3). (PAUL’S HOPE / HOPE OF ISRAEL)

Jerry has denied this. Jerry is wrong.

Jesus said not one iota of Torah could pass until it was all (NOT SOME) fully accomplished (CHART). Jerry told us that the law passed, but the promises remain. He told us that Jesus did fulfill, but then he says he didn’t, he just “set things in motion” for fulfillment. That is not what Jesus said. Jerry is wrong.

The Sabbath and the Feast Days were an integral part of God’s covenant with Israel (CHART). The Sabbaths foreshadowed the eschaton. Jerry says while resurrection was foreshadowed in the law, it was not part of the law. InNotOf / InNotOf-2

I challenged him, repeatedly, to offer even one verse in support of his wild claim. HE SAID HE DIDN’T HAVE TO!  

REALLY, JERRY?

So, Jerry makes a claim that is crucial to his negative, but, he says since he is in the negative he does not have to prove his argument! Based on that distorted “logic” since he is in the negative, he does not have to prove anything! And, when I am in the negative, I don’t have to prove anything I say!     

Folks, you know full well that if I said I did not have to give proof for my (even negative) arguments that Jerry would (rightly) call “foul!” This is UNBELIEVABLE DESPERATION.

 

Re: The Song of Moses, Deuteronomy 32

 

The Song foretold Israel’s last days, the conversion of the Gentiles, and the avenging of the martyrs in Israel’s last days. (CHART)

Jerry says it referred to Moses’ day, even though 32.7 demands that it applied to a time “many generations” after Moses’ day.

Jerry knows that if the Song was still unfulfilled, post cross, his theology is falsified.

The Song predicted the conversion of the Gentiles in Israel’s last days – that did not happen in Moses day! Paul said the Song foretold his ministry- AND JERRY KNOWS IT! Thus, the Song, i.e the law of Moses– was not nullified at the cross.

Paul said the Song was about to be fulfilled at the coming of the Lord in a “very, very little while” (Hebrews 10:30-37– CHART). Jerry claimed that Paul did not know when the Lord’s coming would be. Paul knew it was coming in a “very, very little while.”

Revelation 19:2f says the Song (32:43) would be fulfilled in the judgment of Babylon. Jerry denies this. Jerry is wrong.

The Song Ignored

 

DANIEL 12 FALSIFIES JERRY’S THEOLOGY- AND HE KNOWS IT!

 

Daniel said the resurrection would be when Israel’s power– her covenant relationship with YHVH– was shattered.

In full blown desperation, Jerry initially said Israel’s power was the gospel (1st Neg). Entrapped, he admitted that the power of the holy people was not the gospel.

Soooo, he claimed that… ISRAEL’S POWER WAS HER ARMY. I asked if Israel’s army was destroyed in AD 70. He said, unbelievably, that Israel had no army in AD 70! He should read Josephus, who was a general in the Jewish army.

Sooo, entrapped again, he said… “Israel’s power ended when she ended up in Babylonian captivity just as Daniel said it would.” (My emp) Pure desperation!!

REALLY, JERRY?!?

 

 

 

ISRAEL’S “POWER” WOULD ENDURE UNTIL THE RESURRECTION, WHEN IT WOULD BE SHATTERED.

Daniel wrote chapter 10-12 AFTER THE BABYLONIAN CAPTIVITY! He was PREDICTING the shattering of Israel’s power at the end of the age resurrection, NOR LOOKING BACK ON IT. (Chart)

TO DENY THAT ISRAEL’S POWER WAS HER COVENANT WITH GOD IS FALSE. Thus, the resurrection at the end of the age was when Torah, Israel’s power, was shattered– in AD 70. Jerry is wrong, again. Jerry’s Desperation #1 / #2 #3

It matters not what Jerry says about Acts 1, 1 Corinthians 15, Revelation, or whatever! Daniel 12 irrefutably posits the resurrection at the end of Israel’s age. Jerry has utterly failed to refute this.

 

Matthew 23– The Avenging of the Blood

 

Jesus said all of the blood of all the martyrs, all the way back to Abel would be avenged in his generation. JERRY FLATLY DENIES JESUS’ EMPHATIC WORDS.  CHART

His desperation is manifest.

Isaiah foretold that avenging, in the last days, at the day of the Lord, (2:9-21, 4:4f). CHART

I challenged Jerry to identify when, in the last days, at the day of the Lord, the Lord came and cleansed Jerusalem from her blood guilt, as Isaiah promised. He said Isaiah applied to the Assyrian captivity. This denies what Isaiah and Jesus said.

 

Romans 9.28

McD-Rm9-sumtenon

McD-Suntemnon-2

 

Romans 11.25-27

 

Paul quoted Isa. 27 / 59 to predict the salvation of Israel, which would come at the time of her judgment for shedding innocent blood. (CHART / CHART)

Folks, Jerry has taken THREE DIFFERENT POSITIONS IN ONE DEBATE! (CHART)

No, both texts foretold the judgment of Israel for shedding innocent blood– remember Matthew 23!

Jerry’s utter desperation is on full display.   (CHART / CHART)

 

The Law– The Strength of Sin– Jerry’s Fatal Admissions

 

Paul said the resurrection would be when the law that was the strength of sin would be annulled.

Jerry admitted that the law that is the strength of sin (1 Corinthians 15:55-56) was “the law of Moses.” This is fatal and he knows it!

I asked if the law of Moses, the strength of sin, is still binding? His answer: “No!”

 

Jerry has abdicated.

The resurrection of 1 Corinthians would be when the law that was the strength of sin was overcome– Jerry agrees. 

The law that was the strength of sin was “the law of Moses” (Jerry).

Therefore, the resurrection of 1 Corinthians 15 has been fully accomplished!

I am staggered at Jerry’s desperation.

Paul said the resurrection of 1 Corinthians 15 would be when Isaiah 25.8 would be fulfilled (accomplished, GENETAI). Yet, Jerry brashly claims: “Nothing is said in Isaiah 25:8-10 about the resurrection.”

So, Jerry, swallowing up death has nothing to do with the resurrection? Is that what you believe, now, Jerry? (CHART / CHART / CHART )

WHY THEN DID PAUL SAY THE RESURRECTION WOULD ACCOMPLISH ISAIAH 25?

 

Galatians 4:22f

 Jerry’s desperation is sad.

Paul identified the bondwoman and her son as ISRAEL OF THE FLESH. Did you catch what Jerry did? HE CLAIMS THAT THE CHILDREN OF THE BONDWOMAN REFERRED TO GENTILES AFTER THE FLESH! This is a stunning denial of Paul’s words! CHART / CHART

Paul said: “As it was then, so it is now, the children of the bondwoman persecuted the children of the free. What says the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son.” Jerry denies Paul’s statement that Israel’s persecution of the church would lead to her being casting out.

Oh, wait! I asked Jerry who had dwelt in the presence of God, and was to be cast out for persecuting the church. HE SAID THAT WAS ISRAEL!

Jerry claims that he answered Galatian 4 by showing that 2:16; 5:1-4 teach that the law was nullified. False as usual. Paul said that THE CHRISTIANS HAD DIED TO THE LAW, and were not to subject themselves once again to Torah. Jerry perverts Paul’s words.

 

2 Thessalonians 1

 

Paul preached nothing but the hope of Israel found in the OT. Paul– per Vincent– uses “the precise phrase” from the LXX of Isaiah 2. Yet, Jerry says Paul was not quoting Isaiah!  (McD-LXX-Ths)

That is like saying if Jerry were preaching and said, “Repent and be baptized everyone of you in the name of Jesus” – per Jerry, that would not mean he was quoting Acts 2.38!

Jerry cites commentaries for his theology. I cited world class linguists, not as theological commentary, but for linguistic facts. Jerry does not grasp the difference. These linguists PROVE Paul quoted Isaiah. Even Vincent says Paul uses “the precise phrase.” I challenged Jerry for his Greek credentials for denying this. Answer? Total silence.  Be sure to see this CHART!

Jerry says he is waiting for proof that Paul quoted Isaiah. I GAVE IRREFUTABLE PROOF. But, there are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

The Thessalonians were being persecuted.

Paul promised those Thessalonians relief from that contemporary persecution. (CHART)

He promised that relief: “WHEN the Lord Jesus is revealed.”

Christ could not give the Thessalonians relief from persecution if they were not under persecution at the time of the parousia! (CHART)

Paul did not say that the church– millennia removed– would get relief. He told the Thessalonians that Christ would give THEM relief at the parousia.

Jerry boldly says Jesus did not fulfill Paul’s prophecy! Thus, Paul was a false prophet. CHART

The words of the text could not be clearer, more emphatic. Paul was not speaking of distant events, but first century events.  

Jerry can say he does not accuse Paul of a false prophecy, but he patently does.  CHART

Paul was simply promising what Jesus promised in Matthew 23– the avenging of all the blood of all the martyrs in his generation.

See my book, In Flaming Fire, for a fuller discussion of 2 Thessalonians 1.

 

The Most Holy Place

 

Paul said as long as Torah remained valid there could be no entrance into the Most Holy Place.

JERRY SAYS MAN DOES NOT ENTER HEAVEN UNTIL THE END OF TIME!

Thus, Torah remains valid today.  

 Jerry claims that if man did not enter the MHP until AD 70: “Christ’s death had nothing to do with it, it had to be when Jerusalem was destroyed. Thus Christ’s death was insufficient.”

REALLY, JERRY?

Revelation 11, 15 says no man could enter the MHP UNTIL THE FALL OF BABYLON – when God’s wrath would be completed.

UNBELIEVABLY, Jerry now denies this! (CHART)

Babylon was Rome– per Jerry.

THUS, NO MAN COULD ENTER THE MHP UNTIL THE FALL OF ROME.

So, per Jerry, “Christ’s death had nothing to do with it, it had to be when ROME was destroyed. Thus Christ’s death was insufficient.” Oh, but wait.

Remember, per Jerry, MAN CANNOT ENTER THE MHP UNTIL THE END OF THE CHRISTIAN AGE. So, “Christ’s death has nothing to do with it, IT HAS TO BE THE END Of THE CHRISTIAN AGE! Thus Christ’s death was insufficient.” Be sure t
o see these two charts: MHP-Desperation / More Desperation

See my debate book The End of Torah: At the Cross or AD 70, for a fuller discussion of the MHP.

The Appointed Time Has Come For the Judgment

 

Peter said that the appointed time for the judgment had arrived. He used the anaphoric article, (CHART) which points back to 4:5, meaning that the appointed time for the resurrection had arrived.

In utter desperation, Jerry says I ignored hetoimos (prepared, 4.5) which, he claims, nullifies the anaphoric article. 

THIS IS AN ASTOUNDINGLY BAD ARGUMENT ON THE GREEK! Hetoimos does not negate the anaphoric article– period!

JERRY, I CHALLENGE YOU TO GIVE A GREEK AUTHORITY THAT SAYS HETOIMOS NEGATES THE ANAPHORIC ARTICLE!   (Chart-hetoimos)

 

You can’t do it, and you know you can’t!

1 Peter 4.5 says “the end of all things has drawn near “(eggeken – perfect tense– cf. the same word and tense in Matthew 3.2, THAT JERRY INSISTS MEANS IMMINENCE!)

Only by perverting the meaning of language can the imminence of the end be denied.

Hetoimos, coupled with eggeken in v. 5, coupled with the anaphoric article in v. 17 destroys Jerry’s theology.

 

On Revelation

I have offered strictly internal evidence for the dating and interpretation of Revelation. CHART / CHART Jerry cites uninspired commentators. He even said that internal evidence means nothing until we allow that external evidence to settle the date! THIS IS AN OVERT REJECTION OF INSPIRATION. (CHART-INSPIRATION)

Revelation is about the fulfillment of God’s OT promises made to Israel.

Revelation anticipated the fulfillment of Daniel’s prophecy. Daniel was told the time of fulfillment was far off, thus, to seal up his vision. John was told fulfillment was so near that he was not to seal the book. Jerry says this temporal contrast means nothing. He is wrong.

Jerry says the Gentiles in Asia had no interest in the fall of Jerusalem because that was so far away.

WELL, DID THEY CARE ABOUT JESUS’ RESURRECTION, THAT WAS JUST AS FAR AWAY? Jerry ignored this, naturally.    Be sure to see this CHART.

The Father, who knew that Day and the Hour of Jesus’ parousia, said the APPOINTED TIME (kairos) had drawn near, and “these things must shortly come to pass.”

The judgment of Revelation was so near that the Spirit said, “Let the wicked remain.” (Chart / Chart) How does Jerry deal with the TEXT? Why, he quotes more scholars who have the same misguided theology he does! That proves nothing.

Jerry desperately denied that en tachei meant imminent, but then admitted that en tachei does “demand imminence”! (Entachei / Mello)

He entrapped and contradicted himself– AGAIN.

See my book Who Is This Babylon, for more on these issues.

 

On John the Baptizer

 

Jerry says John the Baptizer foretold Jesus’ incarnation– not the Day of the Lord. Desperation exemplified!

John was Elijah.

Elijah was to proclaim the Day of the Lord.

Therefore, John as Elijah predicted the Day of the Lord, i.e. the wrath about to come. Chart

 

That Day of the Lord would be in application of Mosaic Covenant sanctions of wrath.

Jerry says Torah was shattered at the cross.

I challenged Jerry to tell us when the Lord came in application of Mosaic Covenant wrath, after John, but before the cross, where he claims Torah and covenant sanctions were abrogated. Silence. 
Chart

Jerry knows this single argument falsifies his theology, so he just glossed over it.

 

Jerry and Implications

 

Jerry makes numerous claims about the implications of what I teach. (CHART / CHART)  Jerry clearly does not understand how implication works. An implication built on a false assumption– like Jerry’s– is a false implication, no matter how “good” it might sound. For his implication charges to be true, he must prove the validity of his position, and he has failed, utterly, to do so.

I have thoroughly, scripturally, and logically demonstrated the validity of my affirmative proposition. All Jerry has done is make unsubstantiated claims, flip-flopped positions, made massively self-contradictory arguments, offered uninspired commentators, sought to poison the mind of the readers, ignored my repeated logical arguments, (Chart) and manifested total desperation.

Here is to hoping Jerry can offer something substantive in his affirmative.

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